Second instalment of a two-part docudrama which examines the witness statements of the Ripper case to intricately recreate the famous police investigation as it unfolded. Using state-of-the-art CGI and actor recreations, it plunges the viewer into the heart of Victorian Whitechapel and challenges them to investigate the slayings for themselves.
Actually I meant 'level' but your point stands. Personally I prefer the American 'program' and if we are going to debate the US vs UK usage of grammar and spelling then I would point out that in the latter the full stop should fall outside the quotation, since it is not speech in this case. Supposedly there is some kind of push to adopt the US usage which is inverse but I feel that makes things messy. It is regrettable that the advent of American into English has caused such issues of confusion and conflict.
@Trevor
I trust you mean "are" comparable as opposed to "is".
Oh and in the UK we have "programmes."
Yes, the computer age certainly highlights the lack of literacy in modern society.
Great subject matter, poorly executed.
It amuses me that the levels of illiteracy present in some of the above comments is comparable to those possessed by the population of lower class Victorian London portrayed in this program.
I enjoyed this overview. I have watched and read everything I could find on the Ripper, and I have to ask...is George Hutchinson not a good suspect? A local who knew the area, and the prostitutes, who did not seemingly look out of place loitering near Miller's Court in the early hours, and who followed Mary Kelly, giving a very detailed account of the man who accompanied her...
Very interesting documentary. Thank you.
In my opinion, the outcome of this investigation is wrong, but it is funny because the documentary actually gives the name of whom I believe the real Jack the ripper is, without realising it. The killer is Sir Melville Macnaghten, who became "the boss" of Scotland Yard, right after the last murder (Mary Jane Kelly). The next day of the murder, Warren resigned. This was Macnaghten's objective in performing the murders, the 2 men had history. What happened in Macnaghten's life before and after 1888 is very interesting, and revealing...
Hi Jennifer, Definitive Story was the story of the police investigation at the time and what the witnesses actually saw...It was never intended as a program about suspects. Three is after all many programs on this subject...137 suspects? We simply deal with the suspects concidered at the time by those involved..yours Jeff
Hello everyone, just some quick responces. The bond report turned up fairly recently and there is NO evidence Mary Jane Kelly was pregnant. The Maybrick Diary is a forgery. Actually there is alot of new material still to com to the fore. We did everything possible to make the actors look like (age range) as those we hoped to depict (sorry if you didnt think dirty enough). We did film an interveiw at length withh Bill Beadle about the suspect 'Bury' but there was simply not enough time to fit everything into 90 minutes.....The models created are nothing like any computer game..they were built and created exactly from the original maps and plans of the building construction. yours Jeff
why are some of you so interested in moaning about the graphics of the prog as they are not that relevant to what the prog is about,but actually watching the prog inorder to try to determine the facts from fiction or assumption and then along with any thing else you may have read or seen, drawn your own conclusion as to the possible suspect
Is it me or do the CGI images look incredibly similar to those from the Sherlock Holmes vs. Jack the Ripper game for the xbox 360? The program seems to go along those lines as well...
I'm sure there were more suspects. Why didn't they mention the royal suspect?
The 1st episode was just telling us about it, disapointed not more about the suspects etc
I believe part of the interest in the ripper case is that it hasn’t and can’t now be solved; it’s become one of life’s mysteries like the Loch Ness Monster and UFO’s.
I’ve read the books and seen documentaries done over many years, and whilst this documentary didn’t produce anything new it did show events in a new light and helped interested viewers grasp the “lay of the land” so to speak. Well-done Channel 5
I would have liked to see more about James Maybrick, yet he wasn't featured as a suspect?...However, I won't complain about the scenery or level of performance, it is only a docudrama not a feature!
I thought the cgi mix and acting perfectly adequate, and the programme factually accurate. Just how much money do those moaning expect the production company to spend on a documentary? It's not a Hollywood blockbuster!
Very poor reconstruction of the streets, where is the filth, dirt and rats that would have filled the streets. The dirty clothing that the so called 'actors' would have worn. I am doing my family tree and have family who lived in Flower and Dean St at the time. It was the filthiest street in London. This documewntary does a VERY poor job of giving a true 'visual' authenticity. Shameful and embarrasing. oh and for the record cloth caps were not being worn at this time! Nothing worse that getting history wrong. Just plain lazy!! Ive seen better in am am dram society of untrained actors.
Shame about the graphics- lets the whole program down. They look like they have been "lifted" straight from the HDO adveture game for iphone. Good content however. Just a very wild boast about the State if the art Graphics.....maybe not state of the art for this decade at least.
Very entertaining, but we all know there is no real evidence against any suspect ever put forward. The JTR legend lives on precisely because of that. All the 'ripperoligists' are just making money out of weak, implausible or insubstantiated theories. It will never be solved! Let it lie please!
I have just seen jackthe ripper story on national geographic. this report favours a marchant seaman who was eventually arested and exacuted in the States. check it out although five's documentary was interesting as my first serous intrest but the nat geo gets my vote
Best documentry on JTR i've seen so far and I've seen just about everyone. The indepth take on Victims background and reconstruction was very interesting-Well done Five!
I guess no matter how many people investigate jack the ripper ,we will never know the truth.Its strange that murders had taken place at the begining of the month and the end of the month.What reason was this?
Dorset Street remained a notorious slum following the murder of Mary Jane Kelly and further murders occurred. In 1901, Mary Ann Austin was murdered with ten wounds to her abdomen at Annie Chapman's former home, Crossingham's Lodging House, at 35, Dorset Street.[15] Later, in 1909 there was a Jack-the-Ripper-like killing in No. 20, Miller's Court, the room directly above no. 13 (which had been occupied by Elizabeth Prater in 1888), when a young woman named Kitty Ronan was found with her throat cut.[16] It was believed that Ronan was a prostitute, and, as in the killing of Mary Jane Kelly, her murderer was never found. As in 1888, the landlord of Miller's Court in 1909 was still John McCarthy. The last murder in Dorset Street was the gangland killing of a Soho club manager and a former middleweight boxer called Selwyn Cooney in February 1960. Cooney was shot in the head at a drinking club on the street, staggered down the stairs into the road and there died.[17][18]
and mary kellys door had to be kicked in after the rent collecor saw her mutilaed body through the broken glass.she had to let herself in through the window,so where was the key??????? she was also 3 months pregnant.her boyfriend had been accused of stealing and sacked in oct.she was 29shillings in arrears with the rent.her heart was missing.they said the murderer lived wihin 200 yards of dorset street.who was the 2nd guy watching out,saying lipski when long liz was murdered??
i think francis tumbley was jtr.he was a quack doctor looking for wombs to buy ,in the area at the time,a homosexual woman hater,and dear boss is an american term.he had lived out in the states,and fled back there in nov 1888,with the cops trailin his ship
The ten Bells wasnt Kellys main watering hole but the Ringers, which is no longer there but shown in the program.Theres no evidence the victims new each other.
I am pleased however so many people enjoyed the program, alot of work and research went into getting the facts correct
After watching the episodes again, say if was very poor acting and graphics. But interesting, they should of used some of the footage Micheal Csne's tv drama of JTR in the 80s. I think the police did finally realised who the murder was but was covered up. Because of the embarrisment of stopping his. That they did catch him but let him go. Thinking of the victorian class system the victiums were all the lowes end of the class system and not worth bothering about. That it was one of the two suspects, one had killed themself and the other was locked up in a loonatic asylam. Which is worse than a victorian prison. The reason I feel the papers went silents was because of the estabishment forcing them to be silent. I dont think the 2 first whitchaple victiums were the work fo the Ripper, one was rapped and murdered by a gang and the other was raped and then stapped to death. Not of the other 5 were raped.
Infact in fock law the 5 women knew each other and drank at the 10 bell public house. 2OO yards away from Bucks Row which is now a car park, I noticed the 10 bells was not mentioned in the tv programme and the orginal corner chairs and table from the 10 bells has been removed with the notice mentioning the where the 5 woman used to sit and drink. Must be under new management that do not realise the importance of the area of JTR. All the orginal sitting fittings have been removed and the public house is more like a urban bar than a cockney pub. Shame on you.
possibly THE best thing I've witnessed on television....I loved the production and how it mixed CGI with re-enactments, great presentation of the known facts and intriguing analysis of the suspects...I thought it was great.
i really enjoyed it,i,ve read lots of books on the ripper and it gave more insight into more suspects,also my killer i reckon was royalty,contrafershall
i really enjoyed it,but i still think the killer was royalty,after reading s ect,contravershal i know.
I liked the program although the scenery and drama was a bit naff, however i was disapointed that at no point(in yet another JTR docu) was William Bury mentioned. Firmly believe he was J.T.R, he moved to Dundee with his wife whom he later killed and was brought to justice by hanging at bell st police station. It was the last hanging carried out there. For all the 'experts' involved in the program, not one mentioned this. Disapointed.
possibly THE worst thing i have ever witnessed on tv...poor acting, DREADFUL 'special effects', awful soundtrack and why is there an echo on every single scene scenario. Channel five has ruined yet another british historical moment in time. Give up please.
this is stupid - we see the SAME annimation atleast five time, going around this semi-3D map and looking into a fully annimated street, which was completelty empty. honestly, FIVE, you've got to think of better ways to express it.
Really interesting version of events - I feel 'Murder by Decree' is the best version of events which starred Christopher Plummer as Sherlock Holmes and Doctor Watson was played by the late |James Mason
Well researched but where are comments from experts like Sugden, Fido, Begg and Skinner? I don't agree that Smith & Tabram were Ripper victims. Excellent show however.
Comments (63)
This comment was removed by a moderator
8 months ago
Craig Revell-Borewood
Not definitive just cheap titilation for the masses on a beer budget.
8 months ago
angi
all the videos stop half way through there is something wrong with your player
1 year ago
June
WHY WON'T PART 2 PLAY, BUT THE ADVERTS WILL ? AND WHY WON'T IT LET ME REPORT THE PROBLEM?
This comment was removed by a moderator
1 year ago
Trevor Mcinsley
Actually I meant 'level' but your point stands. Personally I prefer the American 'program' and if we are going to debate the US vs UK usage of grammar and spelling then I would point out that in the latter the full stop should fall outside the quotation, since it is not speech in this case. Supposedly there is some kind of push to adopt the US usage which is inverse but I feel that makes things messy. It is regrettable that the advent of American into English has caused such issues of confusion and conflict.
1 year ago
Stuart
@Trevor I trust you mean "are" comparable as opposed to "is". Oh and in the UK we have "programmes." Yes, the computer age certainly highlights the lack of literacy in modern society. Great subject matter, poorly executed.
1 year ago
Trevor Mcinsley
It amuses me that the levels of illiteracy present in some of the above comments is comparable to those possessed by the population of lower class Victorian London portrayed in this program.
over 1 year ago
emily
this is the greatist thing ever , thid has got mr really interested in history now
over 1 year ago
eve how
was enjoying ythe program until the last 20mins .It wouldnt play although the adverts were fine . How do channel 5manage that !
over 1 year ago
Mark Sparks
I enjoyed this overview. I have watched and read everything I could find on the Ripper, and I have to ask...is George Hutchinson not a good suspect? A local who knew the area, and the prostitutes, who did not seemingly look out of place loitering near Miller's Court in the early hours, and who followed Mary Kelly, giving a very detailed account of the man who accompanied her...
over 1 year ago
Xiquinho
Very interesting documentary. Thank you. In my opinion, the outcome of this investigation is wrong, but it is funny because the documentary actually gives the name of whom I believe the real Jack the ripper is, without realising it. The killer is Sir Melville Macnaghten, who became "the boss" of Scotland Yard, right after the last murder (Mary Jane Kelly). The next day of the murder, Warren resigned. This was Macnaghten's objective in performing the murders, the 2 men had history. What happened in Macnaghten's life before and after 1888 is very interesting, and revealing...
over 1 year ago
Jeff Leahy
Hi Jennifer, Definitive Story was the story of the police investigation at the time and what the witnesses actually saw...It was never intended as a program about suspects. Three is after all many programs on this subject...137 suspects? We simply deal with the suspects concidered at the time by those involved..yours Jeff
over 1 year ago
Jeff Leahy
Hello everyone, just some quick responces. The bond report turned up fairly recently and there is NO evidence Mary Jane Kelly was pregnant. The Maybrick Diary is a forgery. Actually there is alot of new material still to com to the fore. We did everything possible to make the actors look like (age range) as those we hoped to depict (sorry if you didnt think dirty enough). We did film an interveiw at length withh Bill Beadle about the suspect 'Bury' but there was simply not enough time to fit everything into 90 minutes.....The models created are nothing like any computer game..they were built and created exactly from the original maps and plans of the building construction. yours Jeff
over 1 year ago
BTG
why are some of you so interested in moaning about the graphics of the prog as they are not that relevant to what the prog is about,but actually watching the prog inorder to try to determine the facts from fiction or assumption and then along with any thing else you may have read or seen, drawn your own conclusion as to the possible suspect
over 1 year ago
LMS
Is it me or do the CGI images look incredibly similar to those from the Sherlock Holmes vs. Jack the Ripper game for the xbox 360? The program seems to go along those lines as well...
over 1 year ago
Jennifer
I'm sure there were more suspects. Why didn't they mention the royal suspect? The 1st episode was just telling us about it, disapointed not more about the suspects etc
over 1 year ago
Chris
I believe part of the interest in the ripper case is that it hasn’t and can’t now be solved; it’s become one of life’s mysteries like the Loch Ness Monster and UFO’s. I’ve read the books and seen documentaries done over many years, and whilst this documentary didn’t produce anything new it did show events in a new light and helped interested viewers grasp the “lay of the land” so to speak. Well-done Channel 5
over 1 year ago
thomsk
why do they have to show the adverts...ruined a great programme.
over 1 year ago
Ali
i think it had something to do with the royal family
over 1 year ago
Peter
I would have liked to see more about James Maybrick, yet he wasn't featured as a suspect?...However, I won't complain about the scenery or level of performance, it is only a docudrama not a feature!
almost 2 years ago
Juliet Anyaegbunam
They could say gay men do not usually murder women, but not say they would never murder women. A possibility should be allowed.
2 years ago
Geoff
I thought the cgi mix and acting perfectly adequate, and the programme factually accurate. Just how much money do those moaning expect the production company to spend on a documentary? It's not a Hollywood blockbuster!
2 years ago
S G
Very poor reconstruction of the streets, where is the filth, dirt and rats that would have filled the streets. The dirty clothing that the so called 'actors' would have worn. I am doing my family tree and have family who lived in Flower and Dean St at the time. It was the filthiest street in London. This documewntary does a VERY poor job of giving a true 'visual' authenticity. Shameful and embarrasing. oh and for the record cloth caps were not being worn at this time! Nothing worse that getting history wrong. Just plain lazy!! Ive seen better in am am dram society of untrained actors.
over 2 years ago
Chris
Shame about the graphics- lets the whole program down. They look like they have been "lifted" straight from the HDO adveture game for iphone. Good content however. Just a very wild boast about the State if the art Graphics.....maybe not state of the art for this decade at least.
over 2 years ago
Paul
Very entertaining, but we all know there is no real evidence against any suspect ever put forward. The JTR legend lives on precisely because of that. All the 'ripperoligists' are just making money out of weak, implausible or insubstantiated theories. It will never be solved! Let it lie please!
over 2 years ago
the childish person
he was moved to a lunatic lol
over 2 years ago
Will
Anyone interested in this mystery should now read up on William Bury, by far the most promising suspect.
over 2 years ago
erictheviking1
I have just seen jackthe ripper story on national geographic. this report favours a marchant seaman who was eventually arested and exacuted in the States. check it out although five's documentary was interesting as my first serous intrest but the nat geo gets my vote
This comment was removed by a moderator
over 2 years ago
BrianF
Great show, just baffles me how Five can produce great content like this and yet fail with junk like the Vanessa show!
over 2 years ago
Scarlet O'Hell
Best documentry on JTR i've seen so far and I've seen just about everyone. The indepth take on Victims background and reconstruction was very interesting-Well done Five!
over 2 years ago
joolsann
I guess no matter how many people investigate jack the ripper ,we will never know the truth.Its strange that murders had taken place at the begining of the month and the end of the month.What reason was this?
over 2 years ago
Dave L
No mention of the FM on the wall in Kelly's room. Maybrick for me....
over 2 years ago
sophie
Dorset Street remained a notorious slum following the murder of Mary Jane Kelly and further murders occurred. In 1901, Mary Ann Austin was murdered with ten wounds to her abdomen at Annie Chapman's former home, Crossingham's Lodging House, at 35, Dorset Street.[15] Later, in 1909 there was a Jack-the-Ripper-like killing in No. 20, Miller's Court, the room directly above no. 13 (which had been occupied by Elizabeth Prater in 1888), when a young woman named Kitty Ronan was found with her throat cut.[16] It was believed that Ronan was a prostitute, and, as in the killing of Mary Jane Kelly, her murderer was never found. As in 1888, the landlord of Miller's Court in 1909 was still John McCarthy. The last murder in Dorset Street was the gangland killing of a Soho club manager and a former middleweight boxer called Selwyn Cooney in February 1960. Cooney was shot in the head at a drinking club on the street, staggered down the stairs into the road and there died.[17][18]
over 2 years ago
jennie hudson
and mary kellys door had to be kicked in after the rent collecor saw her mutilaed body through the broken glass.she had to let herself in through the window,so where was the key??????? she was also 3 months pregnant.her boyfriend had been accused of stealing and sacked in oct.she was 29shillings in arrears with the rent.her heart was missing.they said the murderer lived wihin 200 yards of dorset street.who was the 2nd guy watching out,saying lipski when long liz was murdered??
over 2 years ago
jennie hudson
i think francis tumbley was jtr.he was a quack doctor looking for wombs to buy ,in the area at the time,a homosexual woman hater,and dear boss is an american term.he had lived out in the states,and fled back there in nov 1888,with the cops trailin his ship
over 2 years ago
Jeff Leahy
The ten Bells wasnt Kellys main watering hole but the Ringers, which is no longer there but shown in the program.Theres no evidence the victims new each other. I am pleased however so many people enjoyed the program, alot of work and research went into getting the facts correct
over 2 years ago
pat
After watching the episodes again, say if was very poor acting and graphics. But interesting, they should of used some of the footage Micheal Csne's tv drama of JTR in the 80s. I think the police did finally realised who the murder was but was covered up. Because of the embarrisment of stopping his. That they did catch him but let him go. Thinking of the victorian class system the victiums were all the lowes end of the class system and not worth bothering about. That it was one of the two suspects, one had killed themself and the other was locked up in a loonatic asylam. Which is worse than a victorian prison. The reason I feel the papers went silents was because of the estabishment forcing them to be silent. I dont think the 2 first whitchaple victiums were the work fo the Ripper, one was rapped and murdered by a gang and the other was raped and then stapped to death. Not of the other 5 were raped. Infact in fock law the 5 women knew each other and drank at the 10 bell public house. 2OO yards away from Bucks Row which is now a car park, I noticed the 10 bells was not mentioned in the tv programme and the orginal corner chairs and table from the 10 bells has been removed with the notice mentioning the where the 5 woman used to sit and drink. Must be under new management that do not realise the importance of the area of JTR. All the orginal sitting fittings have been removed and the public house is more like a urban bar than a cockney pub. Shame on you.
over 2 years ago
sean
will "from hell" be on 5 on demand? i missed the second part
This comment was removed by a moderator
over 2 years ago
bobm2011
rubbish
over 2 years ago
Oblivion
When will this be available in the states?
over 2 years ago
daryl
brilliant,dont know if its true, but live on isle of wightand rumour has it that jtr brother was mayor of ryde about the time of the murders.
over 2 years ago
daryl
very good programe, shame we dont know who the killer was, live on the isle of wight and apparently jtr brother was mayor of ryde?
over 2 years ago
David Steed
possibly THE best thing I've witnessed on television....I loved the production and how it mixed CGI with re-enactments, great presentation of the known facts and intriguing analysis of the suspects...I thought it was great.
over 2 years ago
ibellis
i really enjoyed it,i,ve read lots of books on the ripper and it gave more insight into more suspects,also my killer i reckon was royalty,contrafershall i really enjoyed it,but i still think the killer was royalty,after reading s ect,contravershal i know.
This comment was removed by a moderator
over 2 years ago
Michael Ord
Having seen the 2nd episode, I'm not convinced that Kosminski was the killer. He didn't fit descriptions and Sir Robert Anderson offered no proof.
over 2 years ago
Fiona Messeter
I liked the program although the scenery and drama was a bit naff, however i was disapointed that at no point(in yet another JTR docu) was William Bury mentioned. Firmly believe he was J.T.R, he moved to Dundee with his wife whom he later killed and was brought to justice by hanging at bell st police station. It was the last hanging carried out there. For all the 'experts' involved in the program, not one mentioned this. Disapointed.
over 2 years ago
Huw Easterbrook
possibly THE worst thing i have ever witnessed on tv...poor acting, DREADFUL 'special effects', awful soundtrack and why is there an echo on every single scene scenario. Channel five has ruined yet another british historical moment in time. Give up please.
over 2 years ago
Carla Van Doigt
this is stupid - we see the SAME annimation atleast five time, going around this semi-3D map and looking into a fully annimated street, which was completelty empty. honestly, FIVE, you've got to think of better ways to express it.
over 2 years ago
dave mackenzie
is this available on dvd?
over 2 years ago
Akira
WHY HAVE CHANNEL 5 MOVED IT BACK TO THURSDAY THIS WEEK, MUPPETS
over 2 years ago
moggs
why wont episode 2 play??
over 2 years ago
BrianF
I was just in the Ten Bells last night, for those interested...http://www.casebook.org/victorian_london/tenbells.html
over 2 years ago
martin peake
for people with no knowledge except the stereotypical view of jack the ripper this is the best fact based account of murders plus statements ever
over 2 years ago
Pam Booth
Really interesting version of events - I feel 'Murder by Decree' is the best version of events which starred Christopher Plummer as Sherlock Holmes and Doctor Watson was played by the late |James Mason
over 2 years ago
dodie foster
great the best programe re- jack the ripper great effects
over 2 years ago
Andrew
Paul Begg narrated
This comment was removed by a moderator
This comment was removed by a moderator
over 2 years ago
Mike Ord
Well researched but where are comments from experts like Sugden, Fido, Begg and Skinner? I don't agree that Smith & Tabram were Ripper victims. Excellent show however.